Coffee House The View from 22

Podcast: Julie Burchill vs. Paris Lees, Putin’s plan to rule the world and Cameron’s love for Angela Merkel

20 February 2014

What is intersectionality and why is it ruining feminism? On this week’s View from 22 podcast, Julie Burchill and Paris Lees debate the current state of feminism and whether intersectionality has been damaging to the left. How are the feminists of today different from those in the past? What does the treatment of Julie Bindel show about feminism infighting? And is there any chance of returning to a more traditional strand of socialism?

Mary Wakefield and Freddy Gray also discuss Vladimir Putin’s new plan for world domination. What do the Sochi Winter Olympics tell us about Russia’s hard and soft power in the world today? Why are social conservatives looking to Putin as a voice against the tide of social liberalism from the west?

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Plus James Forsyth and Isabel Hardman discuss David Cameron’s relationship with Angela Merkel and the importance of her visit to London next week. Why she receiving the full red carpet treatment? And what will her visit mean for the Prime Minister’s efforts to renegotiate our relationship with the European Union?

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Show comments
  • David Graham Scott

    Strange but you’d think the one on the left was the unconvincing transexual.

  • David S. Smith

    Julie’s piece was disagreeable but it actually read ok. Here i reckon she comes across very badly – either she didn’t read Paris’ article or was unable to understand the irony behind the title. She made a series of broad generalisations about intersectionality that cite only the worst factions of the movement and showed knee jerk responses based upon the speakers rather than what they actually said (typically a sign that the argument has been lost). She also showed a strange double standard in her saying its wrong to be belittle Moore but that it’s fine to make fun of members of the trans community and spoke like a ‘political’ teenager. Dissapointing.

  • LizLox

    Julie Burchill shocks, Paris Lees rocks.

  • Niggademus


  • Chris Hobson

    The left wing are persistent pessimistic moaners on a crusade to rule the world.

  • Govestrokeshimself

    I’m of the left – but I have to admire the Spectator’s mischief making & this is extremely funny. They are both fools and do no-one on our side any good. Even so Janet Daley & Louise Mensch at least, sound equally mental to my ears. And as for the men… don’t get me started.

  • grutchyngfysch

    This is why I don’t read the New Statesman.

  • Rockin Ron

    Well done Julie, you are brilliant. Quite unfair though to have an intellectual against Paris Lees.

    • Michelle-Louise Burrows

      Julie Burchill? Intellectual? She’s about as intellectual as a cabbage.

      Shows how thick you are that you think Burchill’s an intellectual…

  • Hexhamgeezer

    Its a tough one to call – Burgill’s got the baps and the other one’s got the face. Them feminists sure make it hard for us neanderthal misogynists to work out who’s right.

    • La Fold

      yeah, Paris is pretty tasty, especially since she used to be a boy.

      • Kitty MLB

        Honestly! She was a boy?
        Good God, enough to make you choke on the cornflakes :)

        • La Fold

          Yep! Started out life as a lad.

          • Hexhamgeezer

            …a non-controversial, inoffensive non-sweary reply is ‘awaiting moderation’ apparently

            • La Fold

              ARF! No shame in it fella. Shes pretty tidy!

            • La Fold

              Im not sure, ive never met her but hey who knows? It works out, it doesnt work out, who cares? youve made contact with another soul, there was connection there and whether it was just physical, deeply spiritual or whatever, it was strong enough for you to make some bad decisions togethor. And really thats what lifes all about!

        • Mr Creosote

          Kitty, you must get out more!
          Didn’t you know that Paris is carving out a media career as the “female” version of the baby-faced half wit, Owen Jones?

        • Fergus Pickering

          Is she therefore transgender? I’ve never been sure what that is.

  • CraigStrachan

    Fraser Nelson should probably consider adding Burchill vs Lees to the bill for the cage fight in the Spectator garden.

  • ablanche

    You dont mess with Julie. Paris who sounded like a proper vile non entity left dead on the floor.

  • global city

    Paris Lee ‘wears the clothes’

  • Simon Fay

    Just read Julie B’s piece (quite enjoyable) and found myself shuddering at the toxic mob her peeping over the parapet brought to the Speccie.

  • Radford_NG

    Question is : why are social conservatives in Great Britain looking to Putin as a voice against social liberalism?

    • Simon Fay

      Read the comments under the Burchill piece.

    • global city

      Are they?

    • Chris Bond

      Because our media is so badly infiltrated by the left, that a De Facto embargo on anything other then leftism is in place.

  • Mark

    Thing is, Burchill is write to attack intersectionality but she doesn’t need to act like a reactionary to do it. The left needs to understand what a parody of socialism it is.

  • La Fold

    The real question here is which one would I rather take out for a prawn cocktail, a few shandies and then smash the granny out of? Burchills is most likely to be utter, utter filth with a proven track record.
    However I think i’ll opt for Paris Lees, even call her the next day, im not a monster.

    • John Dalton

      Just know what you’re getting into there old pal!

      • La Fold

        Arf! nice enough face, cracking pair of pins, pffft, why not!

  • Jez

    I’m with Team Burchill on this one.

    The major difference about the two seems that one has grown up, had to fight through some tough real world troubles (that hits us all) and having to get on with it.

    The other participant is still a silly little student type, expecting the world owes her a living.

    To Paris Lees; What is your take and have you acted in defense of vulnerable underage girls being targeted and raped by Grooming gangs here in the North?

    • Anthony Miller

      As white cigendered males we are by default on Team Burchill – it is very scarey … but I do believe the squeaky one is right

      • John Dalton

        I can’t quite understand why Paris Lees is being given the air time. I guess the meedja luvvies are grooming her to be the right on voice of the transgender struggle.

        • Anthony Miller

          Dunno either but they could try Shelley Cooper, Bethany Black or Debra Jane Appleby for a bit of variety. Comedy’s not short of transgendered folk … probably though they might not take it all seriously enough.

    • La Fold

      She disappeared down to brighton and turned into a girl, thats what she done for northern girls.

  • Geronimo von Huxley

    Not listened to the podcast yet but the thing is, you cannot deny that everyone loves Angela Merkel right now, man – not just the British PM.

  • Hello

    Spectator meets Jerry Springer!

  • darwins beard

    lefties hating lefties. Delicious

    • Kitty MLB

      Fighting like two ghastly rats in a sack, vulgar to the extreme,
      are they even ladies ?
      Hate is the only thing they understand and they do that superbly.

  • Kitty MLB

    Must we be constantly bombarded by the Left and their many issues,
    We had years, and years of listening to their empty and quite deluded utterances,
    there are other view in the UK, or is it the case of Leftie domination.
    As for those two above, uncouth caterwauling and lefties spitting bile- I am charmed.
    I shall not even think of Putin’s plan of world domination, the thought is
    both bloodcurdling and horrendous- Do we have any leaders with the gumption
    and strength to deal with these many threats to our freedom.
    As For Cameron, Merkel’s little Chihuahua- heaven help us.

    • Anthony Miller

      The only positive thing about Intersectionality is it exposes the lie espoused by the hard left that “political correctness does not exist” no matter how hard it is promoter or how much money US Academic institutions waste on promoting it which could, of course, be spent on the many it actually marginalises.

  • LadyDingDong

    Now I know why dogs don’t bite bitches; they are more than capable of biting each other. Thank you Speccie for reminding us (as if we needed it) why so many modern lefty women are such awful harridans. The great lady would never have resorted to such caterwauling and neither would Betty Boothroyd or even Barbara Castle.

    • Nicholas chuzzlewit

      Leftist idiot kicking lumps out of a leftist idiot, you have to just love it. Brightens up a wet February day.

  • Colonel Mustard

    Tired of the left. Tired of the causes of the left.

    • Kitty MLB

      The left are so loud and relentless with their bleatings-
      empty vessels and all that Colonel.
      When are we going to here the views of loyal and respectful
      conservatives those who just keep the country running,
      and quietly go about their business- they clearly need to shout louder.

      • Alexsandr

        you left out humourless. When they put the leftyness in they take the humour out.

        • Kitty MLB

          Oh Yes Humour, one of the main points actually.
          You could have a battle of wits with a leftie,
          but cannot because they will be unarmed ( That was quite
          bad I have to say).

    • Chris Bond

      Well you are out of luck. It’s about to get worse. A whole world of hurt worse. It’s name is “Gender Mainstreaming”.
      With what the EU/ UN have in store for us and our future social systems, I vote we go back to hunting and gathering.

      • John Dalton

        That sounds quite terrifying – what does it mean??

        • Chris Bond

          The EU is designing a number of policies which will be passed to the government of the UK who will use them to try and change the very meaning of what constitutes a ‘male’ person and a ‘female’ person.

          They will introduce policies that attack the very structures of society and in particular – the family structure.
          Hence the constant media barrage regarding “Genders”

          It’s been in planning since the UN’s Fourth World Conference on Women in Beijing in 1995. (The EU has committed itself to introduce UN policies in the Lisbon treaty section 2)

    • Cyril Sneer

      Me too.

      It wouldn’t be so bad but it’s BS. All of it.

      I keep promoting it – but see the New Media Journal for an article titled The Liberal Victim Value Index. It’s goes some way in explaining the insanity of liberals and why they think some are more equal than others.

  • tastemylogos

    God, one leftist moron hectoring, bitching ad-hominem slime on another leftist moron. Good grief.

    • dmitri the impostor

      Get off your patriarchal high horse and get with the programme.

      There has been yet another split among the increasingly failing transgender political coalition, as the minority of trans who agree with increased treatment options get tossed yet again under the bus by pro-surgical anti-feminist transgenders. Follow the link marked ‘the treatment of Julie Bindel’. She’s the one that’s not from Brighton.

      • tastemylogos


        Another leftist with a label to throw about.

        Out of interest, do those of the militant LGBT have a handbook of vacuous labels, ready to utilise at any given moment?

        Look, I don’t really care fore either woman (though the younger girl quite clearly more insane, more prone to ad hominem and student unionesque ranting than the older lady). Both are bigots, neither can accommodate alternative world views, hence the pointlessness that was the ‘discussion’ we just listened to.

        Utterly impossible to have a debate with these kind of people. So far up the own backsides that to even give respect to a less radical POV would be an anathema to them both.

        • dmitri the impostor

          I was being jocular but, the internet being what it is, I accept that that may not have been obvious.

          As Henry Kissinger said in another context, debates between splinters of the LGBT ‘community’ get so acrimonious because the stakes are so low. So let’s neither of us waste any more of our lives on this brain-rot, eh?

          • tastemylogos

            fair enough. but I would say, just like the maddening ultra nationalists (BNP not EDL) the left is just impossible to engage with. Even those who are less ;extreme’, ie, the Owen Jones and Mehdi Hasans of this world.

            Just impossible. Full of heckle, disparaging glibness, patronising tone. Sicken me.

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