To which ‘communities’ is Tom Winsor referring?

20 January 2014

People complain that the police sometimes take a terribly long time to turn up to investigate complaints. But then sometimes they do not turn up at all. In fact according to Tom Winsor, the Chief Inspector of Constabulary, ‘there are cities in the Midlands where the police never go because they are never called. They never hear of any trouble because the community deals with that on its own.’

Entire cities in which the police are totally absent! Which ones does he mean? Birmingham? And who are these communities? Tom refers to them mysteriously as people born ‘under different skies’? Venusians, then, perhaps, or ethereal creatures from Betelgeuse. I assume it’s something like that. Because otherwise he would spell it out, wouldn’t he?

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  • stephengreen

    I found hilarious the rent-a-comment in the Indy by Professor Holdaway from a McUniversity

    “Simon Holdaway, a professor of criminology at Nottingham Trent
    University and a former policeman, said he was surprised by Tom Winsor’s
    comments and said he would have expected some independent research
    before such claims were made.”

    An independent study into calls into the police station? Just who did Mr Holdaway have in mind to conduct this ‘independent’ study, one wonders? Is it really necessary in an age where every fact needs to be collected and preserved like an exotic butterfly, being pinned and displayed, for calls to the police to be academically whitewashed before being presented? Having them weighted for ‘bias’, ‘distrust’ and whatever else the modern academic can come up with.

    • James Lovelace

      I studied degrees at 5 UK universities – 2 of them old Polys (McUniversities). I taught at many of the McUniversities.

      The standards between these universities are unbelievable. At the McUniversities it was not uncommon for a lecturer to fail to turn up to class repeatedly. It was known for the “professor” to come into class 1 and say “x is y”, then come into class the next week and say “sorry, got it wrong – x is z”, then come back the next week and say “sorry, got it wrong last week, x is y”.

      I gave up teaching when the majority of students could not turn up to class but still get degrees, when most of those who did turn up to class had not even read the 60 pages of text they were asked to read for that class. They didn’t even have to buy books or get them from the library – the academics broke all copyright laws to provide the “students” (i.e. layabouts) with packages of photocopied material for the entire year.

      I gave up teaching back in 1995. The last 20 years have seen no improvement. The vast majority of these layabouts now get 2:1s or 1sts.

      • stephengreen

        Yes, I can imagine. As mentioned recently, if tertiary education, once the preserve of under 10% of the university-age population, suddenly is encouraged to cater to 45% of that population, the quality of the syllabus aimed at that 45% necessarily suffers. Especially where marking is partially adjusted not as an objective standard but rated as a percentage of those taking exams. As of course does the quality of the available teachers drop with the expansion in education and the need for people to teach them.

  • Jingleballix

    He means Muslims Rod………….the religion of peace.

    You know, the faith that endorses honour killings, stoning to death of homosexuals the subjugation of women (and defilement of white ones), execution for apostates, the destruction of kaffur society and ‘holy war’ against….well, pretty much anything they dislike.

    Still, as one Swedish minister stated………..”We must be open and tolerant towards Islam and Muslims because when we become a minority, they will be so towards us Jens Orbak – Swedish Minister for Intergation, 2006

    Oh dear…………..

  • Robert Sime

    We know who these “communities” are, and both how and why they have been encouraged to create a parallel society. It might be more interesting to probe into Tom Winsor’s past history. He is a Common Purpose-type who pursued privatisation mania in the railways before transferring it to the police (check out his private brokering of billions of pounds’ worth of business for G4S from 10 constabularies before being gifted his current public post).

  • ploppi

    Quite a lot of bobbies in rural towns are well equiped with all the gear , stab vest radio Pepper spray etc etc etc and some mistake their uniform for a suit of armour. At the same time to look at some of them it’s understandable to know that some towns have no go areas where local police dare not venture.
    As for not responding to a complaint fats enough or at all. That does happen too often.
    It has nothing to do with community leaders dealing with it and a lot to do with attitude and why they joined the police force in the first place.

  • Cornelius Bonkers

    Well, can anyone imagine Turks snivelling to the police when one of their shops gets turned-over or their friends robbed? No, they deal with it themselves. Why? Because they originate in a society which a) understands police corruption, and b) values revenge. Like many immigrant “communities” Turks know and care nothing about the rule of law. I would imagine this happens EVERYWHERE in Britain where non-western immigrants have a presence. God help us all!

  • Daniel Maris

    I spy with my little eye something beginning with M….Methodists? Mormons? Mennonites? No…keep trying…

  • K BB

    The greater good ….

  • Agrippina

    Winsor is right, ‘born under different skies’, and bringing their village mentalities with them. I am unclear as to when the govt is going to take action, perhaps before the ghettos up and down the country lead to serious unrest.

    I won’t hold my breath, I just hope that my fellow Brits will see that the last 50yrs of immigration has brought us to this sorry state and we need new blood in Westminster to halt the slide.

  • Agrippina

    Winsor is right, ‘born under different skies’, and bringing their village mentalities with them. I am unclear as to when the govt is going to take action, perhaps before the ghettos up and down the country lead to serious unrest.

    I won’t hold my breath, I just hope that my fellow Brits will see that the last 50yrs of immigration has brought us to this sorry state and we need new blood in Westminster to halt the slide.

    • VitaBrevis1

      I’m afraid Britain has had it. Our rulers clearly prefer those born under different skies, so emigrate and get under them while you still can.

  • tigerlily

    Tom Winsor expressed his views in very very mild terms – but the reality of what he is saying is outrageous. Now can we ban Sharia courts?

  • D Whiggery

    I think we all know who he means. There are cultures that are effectively if not consciously building their own little colonies or city states, with their own laws and their own institutions in the middle of our country and no-one in government has the courage to do anything.

    A multiracial country is perfectly possible but a multicultural country is a contradiction in terms. Countries are more or less geographical representations of peoples with a more or less common culture or cultural heritage. As soon as that stops being true they stop being countries.

    • Robert Sime

      Maybe it’s possible. The point is, should it be obligatory?

  • David Kay

    whats happening here is the same as what happened in northern ireland amongst the republican community. Never rely on the police, always the “community” leaders, then the IRA knee capped any criminals. Then armed paramilitary patrols and vehicle check points to “police” their neighbourhood. Im sure you all know the rest of the story

    If the security services are right about jihadists being trained in syria to continue their jihad here, how long before we see similar actions on the streets of england? How long before the “muslim patrol” become armed?

    The police are letting this happen through fear of being labelled rascist or islamophobic. either that or they are incompetent

  • StephanieJCW

    Tom Winsor should pony up or shut up. State which communities and give evidence of all the crimes he is sure have been committed but which have not been alerted to the police.

    And the obvious follow-up – how does he know about them?

  • arnoldo87

    G’day pommies!
    It’s obvious this wowser is taking about the Australian enclave here in Balsall Heath.
    And we’re pretty spewin about it.
    O.K. – it’s true we can stitch up our own drongos if they transgress – lock em in the dunny for a week or force them to drink Pommy beer, or something similar.
    But it’s nowhere near as bad as he makes out.
    And at least we were born under blue skies, which we haven’t seen any of since we got here!
    Still, what d’ya expect from a guy with a name like Winsor?

    • Pootles

      Best comment on the Speccie website for a good while! Still laughing…

  • ADW

    Recently one community was exposed for some appalling electoral fraud – see

    The Attorney-General, Dominic Grieve, spoke about this and named (community) names. He lasted about 24 hours before being howled down and forced to confess the errors of his ways. He has been silent since, so one assumes his political re-education is complete. Mr Winsor will have known what was in store if he made the silly mistake of actually spelling out what he wanted to say.

    • FrenchNewsonlin

      The judgment ADW points to (see extract) gets to the very nub of the issue Rod raises. The ‘communities’ in question have their roots in, and retain their links to, primitive villages on the Indian subcontinent where the acts examined by the court are rife. If these ‘communities’ had been properly integrated and socialised into Britain (idem applies in other European nations) rather than encouraged to go take their own ‘enriching’ multikulti paths, these practices would in all likelihood have been minimised or eliminated:

      “Mr Sabir Hussain, a very senior member of the local Labour Party, a former candidate in both Parliamentary and local elections and a former Secretary of the Mosque, was explicit on the question of loyalties:
      “I am widely known in the Asian community and well informed on what is happening.
      By way of explanation, the Asian community in Woking comes mainly from the Mirpur District of Kashmir and the Gujarkhan and Jehlum District of Pakistan although moe recently the community has become more diverse. The community is close-knit and is based upon extended family relationships which refer back to the villages of origin in Pakistan. There are social and cultural aspects of the Asian community which I will draw out in this statement.
      … Status within the community is very important and since at lease the 2000s the political party affiliation of candidates has generally been secondary to their prospect of winning election (sic). To may people, seeking electoral success has become important in its own right and commonplace electoral practices prevalent in Pakistan have been imported by some people into Woking. These practices are often corrupt.”

      • ADW

        The lamestream media made very little of the judgment, or indeed of earlier decisions on the same lines, including one from 2005 which described “electoral fraud which would shame a banana republic”. Only independent sites such as here:

        have managed to make anything of it. When Grieve started to raise the issue, he was put firmly back into his box. Good luck, Britain.

        • FrenchNewsonlin

          Not entirely fair! Richard Mawrey QC’s “banana republic” judgment from 2005 — was widely reported (BBC, Guardian and Independent for starters) but given the authoritarian despots ruling at the time, was then ignored. It could and should have been taken up by Cameron as soon as he took office but he, it would seem, is another weaselly puppet pulled by yellow strings and villages in distant lands.

          • ADW

            Ok so maybe I was harsh on the media, but then again since the authorities never did anything about it, the story should have stayed current until they did. Nine years later no-one has done squat. The electoral commission has apparently now decided to do something, but feels that there isn’t enough time to it before the next election (anything done in less than a decade apparently being a rush job)

            • VitaBrevis1

              So far as I am concerned, it is impossible to be too harsh on the BBC.

    • VitaBrevis1

      Grieve spent some time being re educated, along with others in need of the attentions of the ‘therapeutic state’.

  • monkey for sale

    Would throwing shedloads of money at community leaders help?
    Obviously it’s our fault. We are failing these communities; we must be prepared to meet them half way.
    If that doesn’t work, then we have to let them continue to lead separate lives from mainstream society. Overlook the fact that ghettos are turning into countries within a country.

    At this rate the UK looks likely to be sold for a portion of chicken tikka masala, a fear of being called racist and an inability to realise that Islamophobia is a garbage made-up word that was used as a bludgeon to gag free speech.
    Misguided white guilt has a lot to answer for.

  • HenryWood

    In the interview Mr Winsor claimed he was not talking about criminal gangs taking the law into their own hands, rather they were law-abiding people.
    I would have thought vigilantes would be a more accurate description.

  • In2minds

    Tom Winsor, a cross between useful idiot and Establishment lackey so not much will happen thus our police can continue as before in a way that suits them and not us.

  • sarahsmith232

    Yes, we know all about the ways in which those ‘communities’ have been ‘dealing’ with their ‘transgressors’. They first of all begin with a family group battering, one which usually involves multiple male members upon a single female one. If the miscreant manages to escape then are always a ready assortment of various ‘concerned’ bounty hunters that are only too happy to assist those that have been trespassed against. Their then deep devotion to their faith lead them to seek guidance from their unstained religious leaders, a path that leads directly onto their next route – a violent and prolonged exorcism, if their God chooses to kill the girl during this process, then all to the better.
    Yes, I’m we all can agree with this person, it’s all really something that the rest of we white members of hte lower orders should look on in awe and be also trying very hard to emulate.
    Brum police, bless but they have form when it comes to idiot statements.

    • Richard


  • The Elderking

    He’s put his head on the block and senior officers are running for cover. Doesn’t change the reality on the ground though.

  • MikeF

    What ‘community’ really means, of course, is fragmentation and segregation in place of any single form of identity that supercedes local loyalties – what used to called ‘patriotism’. Ironically the people promoting it are much the same as those who howled in anger and outrage at Mrs Thatcher for saying there is ‘no such thing as society’. Even more ironically she didn’t mean that it that way, but now they do.

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